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Thread: A litte Wide field EP History

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    Default A litte Wide field EP History



    Found this on the Stellarvue website (yes, I've spent way too much time there lately...) and stumbled across this ES100 14mm page.
    There are few great nuggets of history in there about the development of "ultra-wide field" eyepieces and their origins I had no clue about.
    Yes, it is a vendor page but well worth the 2 minute read:

    Stellarvue EPWP10014

    U-boats & Cannons, who knew?
    Here's hoping some of our own EP historians will enhance the history lesson. (Professor JG, Gabby & nFA you out there?)
    AD10, SV102T, AR127 & ST80 M2 & SW AZEQ6 GT Mounts ES82 11 18 24, ES100 5.5 9 14 20, KK Orthos, BCO 6, 10mm, Vixen HR 2.4, 3.4 Vortex 10X50, ACD 75 Astro Mutt
    "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." - Robert A. Heinlein


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    Default Re: A litte Wide field EP History

    There is also the Erfle, Galoc, Military Bertele, Dial Sight and Kaspereit to start the list
    Refractors: Antares 105 f/15, Bresser 102XL f/13.2, Celestron 102 f/6.5, 2-150 f/8, Stellarvue NHNG 80 f/6.9, TAL 100RS f/10, TS 102 f/11, Vixen SD115s f/7.7
    Mounts: Manfrotto 028B/ 055PRO, Celestron SLT, Celestron CG-5/ Argo Navis, Stellarvue M2C, Vixen SXP Binoculars: Celestron Eyepieces: A-Z

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    The weakest link in the optical chain is the large nut located directly behind the eyepiece/ camera. - Gabrielle
    Ya gotta keep this Apo/Achro thing in some balance of perspective. Apos are awesome, but long focus Achros aren't that far behind them - Siriusandthepup (CN)
    Refractors kick arse precisely because they don't hide behind excuses. That is, they have no obstructions to hide behind.

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    Default Re: A litte Wide field EP History

    Quote Originally Posted by Gabby76 View Post
    There is also the Erfle, Galoc, Military Bertele, Dial Sight and Kaspereit to start the list
    Show off...
    upfyrman, SpyderwerX and sketrip like this.
    Bryan
    Scopes: Apertura AD12 f/5; Celestron C6-R f/8; ES AR127 f/6.4; ES AR127 f/9.4; Stellarvue SV102T f/7; ES AR102 f/9.8; iOptron MC90 f/13.3; Orion ST80A f/5; Celestron Premium 80 f/11.4; Celestron C80 f/11.4; Meade NG60 f/10
    Mounts: Celestron AVX; Bresser EXOS-2; ES Twilight I; ES Twilight II; iOptron Cube-G; AZ3/wood tripod; Vixen Polaris
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    Binoculars: Pentax PCF WP II 10×50, Bresser Corvette 10×50, Bresser Hunter 16×50 and 8×40, Garrett Gemini 12×60 LW, Gordon 10×50, Apogee 20×100

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    Default Re: A litte Wide field EP History

    Quote Originally Posted by Gabby76 View Post
    There is also the Erfle, Galoc, Military Bertele, Dial Sight and Kaspereit to start the list
    Well come on, give us the run down!
    In some ways I wish I hadn't found it - sooner or later there will be searches on the net and it will be 0400 before I realize what time it is....
    AD10, SV102T, AR127 & ST80 M2 & SW AZEQ6 GT Mounts ES82 11 18 24, ES100 5.5 9 14 20, KK Orthos, BCO 6, 10mm, Vixen HR 2.4, 3.4 Vortex 10X50, ACD 75 Astro Mutt
    "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." - Robert A. Heinlein


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    Default Re: A litte Wide field EP History

    There are so many of todays eyepiece designs that are offshoots of one of those designs. Also a lot of good eyepieces that are no longer made can be found in auction collections/ dealers.
    I imagine that there is not a single astronomer that does not have an eyepiece that is based on a Zeiss design.
    sketrip likes this.
    Refractors: Antares 105 f/15, Bresser 102XL f/13.2, Celestron 102 f/6.5, 2-150 f/8, Stellarvue NHNG 80 f/6.9, TAL 100RS f/10, TS 102 f/11, Vixen SD115s f/7.7
    Mounts: Manfrotto 028B/ 055PRO, Celestron SLT, Celestron CG-5/ Argo Navis, Stellarvue M2C, Vixen SXP Binoculars: Celestron Eyepieces: A-Z

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    The weakest link in the optical chain is the large nut located directly behind the eyepiece/ camera. - Gabrielle
    Ya gotta keep this Apo/Achro thing in some balance of perspective. Apos are awesome, but long focus Achros aren't that far behind them - Siriusandthepup (CN)
    Refractors kick arse precisely because they don't hide behind excuses. That is, they have no obstructions to hide behind.

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    Default Re: A litte Wide field EP History

    This is an interesting excerpt from that Stellarvue blurb:

    "Each and every Explore Scientific eyepiece is inspected both at the factory and again at our USA facility in California."

    Hmmmmmmmmmm
    Abb
    Telescopes: Celestron Omni XLT 120, Explore Scientific AR102, Orion ST80 Refractors; 8" Skywatcher Dob; Orion Apex 102 Mak; Coronado PST. EP's: ES 4.7, 6.7, 11, 18 and 30mm 82° EPs; Baader 24mm 68°; Luminos 15mm 82°; Meade 8-24mm Zoom. Other: CG4+16" Orion Pier Extension; Celestron 15x70 binos etc;

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    The Bible tells us God created the Universe; Science tells us how He did it; And through my telescopes I marvel at His handiwork

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    Default Re: A litte Wide field EP History

    Thanks Sketrip for bringing up the ultrawides to attention.

    Our not_Fritz_Argelander has somewhere posted a *.pdf file "EVOLUTIONofEYEPIECE", so we will get it again as soon as he jumps into the thread.

    The ES ultrawides have been hands-on qualified by Sven Wienstein, the guru #1 in testing the eyepieces
    and Barlows. What is Wolfgang Rohr in the telescopes testing, is Sven Wienstein (astronomie.de forum and his web pages) in the eyepieces testing.
    Please pay attention to the test of the 14mm Explore Scientific against the 13 mm Tele Vue Ethos, and especially to the last pic showing the X-rayed comparison, 14mm Explore Scientific - 13mm TeleVue Ethos
    The trick in the Ethos design is the double Smyth assembly in the eyepiece nose, sending an ultrawidened cone of light into an extra large aperture eyepiece.

    Some historical military ultrawide designs, still found on the markets in Germany, have been reviewed in Okular Test Vergleich und Beschreibung . They are essentially the Astroplan oculars, as used by our not_Fritz_Argelander during his times in the astronomy observatory. The Astroplans have been manufactured by Zeiss in Jena for the astronomy observatories back in the 60s and 70s.
    I am keeping my eyes open to get one of these old military or old observatory grade Astroplans for my vintage optics collection.

    The history of the Al Nagler's designs is here: The evolution of eyepiece developments at Tele Vue - Astronomy Magazine - Interactive Star Charts, Planets, Meteors, Comets, Telescopes

    Best,

    not_professor_JG
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    Default Re: A litte Wide field EP History

    Sky-Watcher Explorer 130M, EQ5 Deluxe, AZ5 Deluxe, SkyMax 102mm, SkyMax 127mm, Evostar 72ED DS Pro, ST80, ST102 (modified), Vixen Porta II/Vixen SXG Hal-130, Orion 90mm StarMax , Orion ST80 (modified), Celestron NexStar Evolution 9.25", TS Optics/GSO: SVD series 150mm, f/6. A load of eyepieces including: Antares, Astro Hutech, Baader, Bresser, BST, Bushnell, Celestron, Explore Scientific, GSO, Kokusai, Meade, Orion, Sky-Watcher, Solomark, SvBony, TeleVue, Vixen & one or two I'm not sure of. William Optics: Binoviewer.

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    Default Re: A litte Wide field EP History

    Quote Originally Posted by Shorty Barlow View Post
    That is the PDF which I previously posted so there is no need to repost again.
    j.gardavsky and sketrip like this.
    Past items italicized. Scopes: Refractors: Orion ST80 (mods for white light solar), SV ED80 f7, Orion and SW 80 and 120 ED, Orion ED80T, Orion 120 f8.3, Tasco 30x30, Edmund 40; Newtonians: Z12 f5, self made 6” f9, AT 8”f4, OC 8”f6.3, Orion 10" f4.7, Orion XX14i; Catadioptrics: VMC110L, Intes MK66, Orion 102 MakCas f12.7, Celestron 9.25 SCT and 9.25 Edge. EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, TV Nagler, ES100s, Edmund Orthoscopics, Baader Hyperions. Mounts: Orion Sirius EQG, Star Seeker III, Celestron CG5, Vixen Porta II, Orion Atlas, Losmandy G11

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    Default Re: A litte Wide field EP History

    Quote Originally Posted by Gabby76 View Post
    There is also the Erfle, Galoc, Military Bertele, Dial Sight and Kaspereit to start the list
    Ray tracing diagrams for the Erfle, Plossl, and Orthoscopic designs suggest that Erfles should be excellent planetary eyepieces, btw. The width of the field such that the ray bundle is diffraction limited is larger in the Erfle. So if light scatter could be as well controlled...they should be excellent. I suspect that it's this wider AFOV of truly sharp performance that led to pushing the AFOV even wider.

    Also lets not forget wide field Konig designs which also had WW I military uses.
    Past items italicized. Scopes: Refractors: Orion ST80 (mods for white light solar), SV ED80 f7, Orion and SW 80 and 120 ED, Orion ED80T, Orion 120 f8.3, Tasco 30x30, Edmund 40; Newtonians: Z12 f5, self made 6” f9, AT 8”f4, OC 8”f6.3, Orion 10" f4.7, Orion XX14i; Catadioptrics: VMC110L, Intes MK66, Orion 102 MakCas f12.7, Celestron 9.25 SCT and 9.25 Edge. EPs: KK Fujiyama Orthoscopics, 2x Vixen NPLs (40-6mm) and BCOs, Baader Mark IV zooms, TV Panoptics, Delos, TV Nagler, ES100s, Edmund Orthoscopics, Baader Hyperions. Mounts: Orion Sirius EQG, Star Seeker III, Celestron CG5, Vixen Porta II, Orion Atlas, Losmandy G11

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