Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 22
Like Tree7Likes

Thread: Soft landing of SpaceX's Falcon 9 Rocket...

  1. #11
    Caparris's Avatar
    Caparris is offline Main Sequence
    Points: 6,215, Level: 54
    Level completed: 33%, Points required for next Level: 135
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    365 Days+ Registered Achievement!50 Posts Achievement!5 Threads Achievement!750 Days+ Registered Achievement!First 1000 Experience Points
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    187
    Points
    6,215
    Level
    54
    Thanks
    17
    Thanked 37x 24 Posts

    Default Re: Soft landing of SpaceX's Falcon 9 Rocket...



    Quote Originally Posted by John999R View Post
    That is impressive and fun to watch, but how practical is it when the rocket is using tremendous amounts of fuel? I can only see that happening if the ingredients for making rocket fuel is found on the moon.
    While landing the first stage on the moon or mars would be very cool, the idea is a little different than that

    The idea is that fuel is only about $200K per launch on a Falcon 9, while the first stage is something like $30-40M (of a $70M total launch cost). Normally the first stage burns up on the way down or slams into the ocean, either way ending it's existence. That's a lot of money to throw away every launch..

    The idea here is to fly the first stage back to the launch site so it can be reused, thus saving roughly half of the launch costs if you can re-fly one (obviously that's making huge assumptions about it being physically possible to re-use one, but you can't try if you can't get it back to begin with..)
    John999R likes this.
    Celestron 8i OTA
    Hypertuned CGEM
    Canon 1100D

  2. #12
    John999R's Avatar
    John999R is offline HYPER GIANT
    Points: 20,532, Level: 99
    Level completed: 7%, Points required for next Level: 468
    Overall activity: 8.0%
    Achievements:
    200+ Posts Achievement!50 Posts Achievement!5 Threads Achievement!First 1000 Experience Points400+ Posts Achievement
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Sacramento
    Posts
    1,551
    Points
    20,532
    Level
    99
    Thanks
    286
    Thanked 293x 238 Posts

    Default Re: Soft landing of SpaceX's Falcon 9 Rocket...

    Good points, but it makes me wonder how much fuel in reserve must the launch rocket have in order to make a soft landing back on earth? From what I've read about these things (which isn't much), weight is a major factor in calculating a lot of things about escaping earth's gravity. I'm sure the engineers/scientists have it all worked out on paper already, I like the concept of recycling and I hope they can make it work.
    AstroTech 106 Triplet APO, Celestron 11" EdgeHD, AstroPhysics 900GTO, Canon 60Da and a bunch of other stuff.

  3. #13
    Caparris's Avatar
    Caparris is offline Main Sequence
    Points: 6,215, Level: 54
    Level completed: 33%, Points required for next Level: 135
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    365 Days+ Registered Achievement!50 Posts Achievement!5 Threads Achievement!750 Days+ Registered Achievement!First 1000 Experience Points
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    187
    Points
    6,215
    Level
    54
    Thanks
    17
    Thanked 37x 24 Posts

    Default Re: Soft landing of SpaceX's Falcon 9 Rocket...

    Quote Originally Posted by John999R View Post
    Good points, but it makes me wonder how much fuel in reserve must the launch rocket have in order to make a soft landing back on earth? From what I've read about these things (which isn't much), weight is a major factor in calculating a lot of things about escaping earth's gravity. I'm sure the engineers/scientists have it all worked out on paper already, I like the concept of recycling and I hope they can make it work.
    I'm going from memory here, but it's something like 7% of the original launch weight can make it to orbit, and the extra fuel to make this work uses I think it was 1-2% of that 7%, so it does certainly either increase the amount of fuel needed or decrease the weight you can put in orbit depending on how you look at it

    Either way, the potential savings from saving/reusing the 1st stage makes it worth it (couple thousand dollars in fuel vs $30M for a new first stage)

    Of course there's still a lot to be proven of whether it's even possible to re-fly a first stage, much less re-fly one quickly/cost effectively like SpaceX ultimately wants to do

    At least they're trying, though
    John999R likes this.
    Celestron 8i OTA
    Hypertuned CGEM
    Canon 1100D

  4. #14
    John999R's Avatar
    John999R is offline HYPER GIANT
    Points: 20,532, Level: 99
    Level completed: 7%, Points required for next Level: 468
    Overall activity: 8.0%
    Achievements:
    200+ Posts Achievement!50 Posts Achievement!5 Threads Achievement!First 1000 Experience Points400+ Posts Achievement
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Sacramento
    Posts
    1,551
    Points
    20,532
    Level
    99
    Thanks
    286
    Thanked 293x 238 Posts

    Default Re: Soft landing of SpaceX's Falcon 9 Rocket...

    Yes, I agree. Thanks for bringing up this interesting topic.
    AstroTech 106 Triplet APO, Celestron 11" EdgeHD, AstroPhysics 900GTO, Canon 60Da and a bunch of other stuff.

  5. #15
    Caparris's Avatar
    Caparris is offline Main Sequence
    Points: 6,215, Level: 54
    Level completed: 33%, Points required for next Level: 135
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    365 Days+ Registered Achievement!50 Posts Achievement!5 Threads Achievement!750 Days+ Registered Achievement!First 1000 Experience Points
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    187
    Points
    6,215
    Level
    54
    Thanks
    17
    Thanked 37x 24 Posts

    Default Re: Soft landing of SpaceX's Falcon 9 Rocket...



    A water landing from last week I believe it was...

    Also, is that an english bulldog John999R? If so, I have one as well.. great dogs (although loud and stinky, lol)
    Celestron 8i OTA
    Hypertuned CGEM
    Canon 1100D

  6. #16
    John999R's Avatar
    John999R is offline HYPER GIANT
    Points: 20,532, Level: 99
    Level completed: 7%, Points required for next Level: 468
    Overall activity: 8.0%
    Achievements:
    200+ Posts Achievement!50 Posts Achievement!5 Threads Achievement!First 1000 Experience Points400+ Posts Achievement
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Sacramento
    Posts
    1,551
    Points
    20,532
    Level
    99
    Thanks
    286
    Thanked 293x 238 Posts

    Default Re: Soft landing of SpaceX's Falcon 9 Rocket...

    Yes, she's our "Mangia" or Italian for eat. We love her, what a character. She doesn't smell since she's 90% indoors so we don't have to bath her but once a month. What really improved her health was a grain free diet, the changes were amazing and no yeasty smell on her face anymore. Besides that she had problems with "head bobs" and we tried all kinds of methods and not until trying the grain free did anything work very well. Yogurt and honey helped, but since putting her on grain free over six months ago she has not had one episode. However, she did suffer from scary seizures up until around three years ago, but Phenobarbitol fixed that problem. She's now seven years old, seems like we got her just yesterday and she spends 90% of her time following me around the house, I'm home office. You said loud? Man, does she snore! I have to position her head just at the right angle so she can breath without snoring and keeping us awake. We both say we haven't had a good night's rest since we got her, but we don't regret a second of it. We just can't kick her out of the bedroom, or our bed for that matter. We would be worried something might happen to her in the middle of the night.

    Space X also does soft landings on land as well, pretty cool watching a video of that. I don't know how practical that is with the apparent hugh amount of fuel it takes to land standing up.
    AstroTech 106 Triplet APO, Celestron 11" EdgeHD, AstroPhysics 900GTO, Canon 60Da and a bunch of other stuff.

  7. #17
    Caparris's Avatar
    Caparris is offline Main Sequence
    Points: 6,215, Level: 54
    Level completed: 33%, Points required for next Level: 135
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    365 Days+ Registered Achievement!50 Posts Achievement!5 Threads Achievement!750 Days+ Registered Achievement!First 1000 Experience Points
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    187
    Points
    6,215
    Level
    54
    Thanks
    17
    Thanked 37x 24 Posts

    Default Re: Soft landing of SpaceX's Falcon 9 Rocket...

    Quote Originally Posted by John999R View Post
    Yes, she's our "Mangia" or Italian for eat. We love her, what a character. She doesn't smell since she's 90% indoors so we don't have to bath her but once a month. What really improved her health was a grain free diet, the changes were amazing and no yeasty smell on her face anymore. Besides that she had problems with "head bobs" and we tried all kinds of methods and not until trying the grain free did anything work very well. Yogurt and honey helped, but since putting her on grain free over six months ago she has not had one episode. However, she did suffer from scary seizures up until around three years ago, but Phenobarbitol fixed that problem. She's now seven years old, seems like we got her just yesterday and she spends 90% of her time following me around the house, I'm home office. You said loud? Man, does she snore! I have to position her head just at the right angle so she can breath without snoring and keeping us awake. We both say we haven't had a good night's rest since we got her, but we don't regret a second of it. We just can't kick her out of the bedroom, or our bed for that matter. We would be worried something might happen to her in the middle of the night.

    Space X also does soft landings on land as well, pretty cool watching a video of that. I don't know how practical that is with the apparent hugh amount of fuel it takes to land standing up.
    Good idea on the grain free--I went and bought some grain free food today to give that a try for at least a few weeks to see if that helps. She has always had that yeasty smell and I never have been able to get rid of it, even with religously cleaning her wrinkles. I've been fortunate that she's only had I think one skin infection ever

    Mine is inside most of the time too (especially with the heat/humidity here during the summer) but for better or worse, she goes crazy if I don't let her run around and play pretty hard at least a little bit every other day. I always was told english bulldogs are the laziest dogs ever, but mine apparently didn't get the memo. She'd play until she died (literally) if I'd let her. She's 7 years old now though, and is starting to have more pain the day after running around hard, so I'm trying not to let her play too much.

    SpaceX is going to do it one way or another it looks like, or go down trying.. their last landing was in the ocean and would have (as far as they've told anyone at least) worked just fine on land. Speaking of the amount of fuel needed, on the next two launches they will be using basically everything they have to get the satellite they're launching to the velocity it needs to reach, so, no more first stage landing attempts for a little while. They've said that really that type of launch should be done from their larger (not yet complete) falcon "heavy" rocket, but they can get it done with the falcon 9, albeit barely.

    It's not as much fuel as you'd think to do the landing, and def worth it to save the first stage. I can't wait to see one of these first stages coming down to a landing vertically on land.. hopefully it happens before the end of the year
    Celestron 8i OTA
    Hypertuned CGEM
    Canon 1100D

  8. #18
    John999R's Avatar
    John999R is offline HYPER GIANT
    Points: 20,532, Level: 99
    Level completed: 7%, Points required for next Level: 468
    Overall activity: 8.0%
    Achievements:
    200+ Posts Achievement!50 Posts Achievement!5 Threads Achievement!First 1000 Experience Points400+ Posts Achievement
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Sacramento
    Posts
    1,551
    Points
    20,532
    Level
    99
    Thanks
    286
    Thanked 293x 238 Posts

    Default Re: Soft landing of SpaceX's Falcon 9 Rocket...

    I think strongly you will be very happy with the grain free food, we use the Blue brand. Also, her poops are more firm as well, she got a little constipated at first, but with normal walks and some fun play indoors (too hot out here as well), shes good now. We transitioned her over to the new food, took over a week I recall. Best positive change in her health ever and I forgot to mention she had a previous skin condition that prompted us to try grain free in the first place, that was after taking her to the vet for the condition. It took quite a while for the spots to clear up using medication, but once we put her on grain free the condition improved rapidly and has never returned. Both my wife and I are thrilled with the improvements. My girl is also 7 years old and loves to play as well, same thing though, we have to slow her down for her own good. Aren't Bulldogs the most character filled dogs ever? Just her looking straight at you, the picture of cuteness. My youngest daughter got me a license plate frame for XMas, it reads: "my favorite child is my Bulldog".

    I would like to see Space X pull off a backwards landing, although I have seen a test vehicle do it. If they try it on a normal mission where a satellite is deployed, it might look a little odd coming down without the nose or even a final stage. Maybe that helps though, less weight to contend with. With a straight down landing there will be no need to send salvage crews out to recover boosters. Good to know the fuel factor apparently is a none issue and I agree, I'm looking forward to the event. Good luck with your Bully and please let me know how she does on the food in a month of so.
    AstroTech 106 Triplet APO, Celestron 11" EdgeHD, AstroPhysics 900GTO, Canon 60Da and a bunch of other stuff.

  9. #19
    trynda1701's Avatar
    trynda1701 is offline Main Sequence
    Points: 4,144, Level: 43
    Level completed: 30%, Points required for next Level: 106
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    2 Posts Achievement20 Posts Achievement!5 Threads Achievement!50 Posts Achievement!First 1000 Experience Points
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    UK, Sol 3, Orion Spur, Perseus Arm, Milky Way Galaxy, Local Group
    Posts
    59
    Points
    4,144
    Level
    43
    Thanks
    169
    Thanked 9x 9 Posts

    Default Re: Soft landing of SpaceX's Falcon 9 Rocket...

    This does look cool, but although reusability helps in the cost department, I feel that there are many more challenges to overcome in this fascinating project.

    One day, we'll get to see the Eagle transporter from "Space:1999"!

    Mark

    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
    : Celestron C8 Classic (Black - 1990?),
    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
    Heritage 130P (2014)
    Eps: 24mm, 16mm ES Maxvision 68° Panoptics; 18mm, 12mm, 8mm BST Explorer 60° Plossls; 25mm Celestron Kellner; 40mm, 9mm Japanese Kellners; 25mm, 10mm Skywatchers; Skywatcher 2x
    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
    .
    Binocs: Helios Apollo HR 15x70 (2016). CZJ Jenoptem 10x50W (1989?), Manfrotto 679B Monopod (2013), DynaSun WT011H TriggerGrip Ballhead (2013), Vanguard Tripod [T-120223AB] (1989?). Olympus 8x40 DPS I (2015). Halina Discovery 8x30 [2 pairs].

  10. #20
    Caparris's Avatar
    Caparris is offline Main Sequence
    Points: 6,215, Level: 54
    Level completed: 33%, Points required for next Level: 135
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    365 Days+ Registered Achievement!50 Posts Achievement!5 Threads Achievement!750 Days+ Registered Achievement!First 1000 Experience Points
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    187
    Points
    6,215
    Level
    54
    Thanks
    17
    Thanked 37x 24 Posts

    Default Re: Soft landing of SpaceX's Falcon 9 Rocket...

    Quote Originally Posted by John999R View Post
    I would like to see Space X pull off a backwards landing, although I have seen a test vehicle do it. If they try it on a normal mission where a satellite is deployed, it might look a little odd coming down without the nose or even a final stage. Maybe that helps though, less weight to contend with. With a straight down landing there will be no need to send salvage crews out to recover boosters. Good to know the fuel factor apparently is a none issue and I agree, I'm looking forward to the event. Good luck with your Bully and please let me know how she does on the food in a month of so.
    Not the greatest footage.. but here is a video from a landing in the sea after putting a satellite in orbit. This is the real deal and could have (as far as we know) successfully landed on land had it been allowed to do so. I'd like to smack the photographer who couldn't keep centered on the rocket at the very end, but he was on a plane after all and I'm sure he was using a very powerful lens

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIlu7szab5I

    Quote Originally Posted by trynda1701 View Post
    This does look cool, but although reusability helps in the cost department, I feel that there are many more challenges to overcome in this fascinating project.

    One day, we'll get to see the Eagle transporter from "Space:1999"!

    Mark
    I'm sure there are more challenges than we will probably ever know about, but at least they're trying and seem to be headed in the right direction.

    Here's a video from a test vehicle the other day that basically self destructed during a test:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBSLPB1p800

    and their CEO's comment on it:

    "Earlier today, in McGregor, Texas, SpaceX conducted a test flight of a three-engine version of the F9R test vehicle (successor to Grasshopper)," the company said in a statement. "During the flight, an anomaly was detected in the vehicle and the flight termination system automatically terminated the mission.

    "Throughout the test and subsequent flight termination, the vehicle remained in the designated flight area. There were no injuries or near injuries. An FAA representative was present at all times."

    SpaceX founder and chief designer Elon Musk said in a Twitter posting the "three engine F9R Dev1 vehicle auto-terminated during test flight. No injuries or near injuries. Rockets are tricky..."
    The cost difference is huge but would obviously depend on what had to be done in between launches. Their goal is basically nothing (other than fuel obviously) for I believe it was 10 launches in a row.. then having to do a refurb of some sort. Right now it's something like $70 million to launch on falcon 9R, but of that figure less than half a million is for fuel. If they get to where they could launch 10 times without any major work in between launches then you're down under $10 million per launch roughly, depending on refurb costs.

    Lots of if's and maybe's, but we shall see. I just wish they'd launch more often and get it over with. I want people on Mars already!
    Celestron 8i OTA
    Hypertuned CGEM
    Canon 1100D

 

 
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. SpaceX
    By olddogg60 in forum Space Forums
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 04-14-2014, 08:27 PM
  2. DSLR Deep Sky Imaging: ISS and SpaceX Dragon
    By corpusse in forum Astrophotography Forum
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 05-27-2012, 04:14 PM
  3. Falcon 1 Flight 5 Tongiht (13 July)
    By jeebusroxors in forum Off Topic Forum
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 07-14-2009, 04:36 PM
  4. SpaceX a bust!
    By Mike in forum Amateur Astronomy Forum
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 03-28-2006, 06:19 AM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.0
Powered by vBulletin®
All times are GMT. The time now is 09:55 AM.