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Thread: Z12 eyepeice, 2 or 3 good starters

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    Default Re: Z12 eyepeice, 2 or 3 good starters



    Well, good to know. I may be narrowing in on two of the three. Just need to look at a good low power. Like I said, the 30mm zhumell that came with it everyone says is a good piece, however I can see visible pitting on it just holding it to the light. Might just see how it does so I'd just have to make 2 purchases at once. Then if not I can wait next month and upgrade it. Thank you for your help.

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    Default Re: Z12 eyepeice, 2 or 3 good starters

    I suggest buying from a reputable astronomy vendor, there are many and most that carry the same equipment usually have the same prices.

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    Default Re: Z12 eyepeice, 2 or 3 good starters

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayj12 View Post
    Well, good to know. I may be narrowing in on two of the three. Just need to look at a good low power. Like I said, the 30mm zhumell that came with it everyone says is a good piece, however I can see visible pitting on it just holding it to the light. Might just see how it does so I'd just have to make 2 purchases at once. Then if not I can wait next month and upgrade it. Thank you for your help.
    It must have been used harshly if there is pitting. I have that eyepiece as well. It's ok but not great in the Z12. Stars get soft at the edge of field. I find it works better in slower scopes.

    You need at least a good 30mm as a finder and a ~20mm (18 to 22) as a mid range. Those and a good 2x Barlow can get you started. Then you would have exit pupils of 6, 4, 3, and 2mm. A good starting point.

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    Default Re: Z12 eyepeice, 2 or 3 good starters

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayj12 View Post
    I don't mind taking glasses off, and leaving them off for that matter haha. I'm planning only getting 3 right now. Low, mid, and high. So, if I were to get a BCO now because they are available I'd be good to go. I stated to the other gentleman that I plan on the dso things. My daughter is more interested in the planets, although I am too, don't get me wrong. I'd be doing more of the observing that is. As long as they give a decent view of a planet, like it doesn't have to be picture perfect, and I'm not going to be trying to pick out the different bands on Jupiter Haha. But at least when she looks at it she'll be able to say "wow, that's Jupiter, or Saturn " you know. That would be good enough to satisfy for now. Then I can wait until I can find a KK. I found a 7mm actually but I didn't know if it would be too much around here, also it was on Aliexpress lol. Not too sure about that. I did see a Takahashi(?) 9mm. Is that comparable to the KK? Like I said though, I'll prob get a Bco for now then fill in later. Thanks for all the help. It's really appreciated. Good luck getting your base fixed. I'm still waiting on the lazy susan rocker part to come in. Should be here tomorrow though. Then it's supposed to rain the next few days. Ain't it always the case.
    The BCOs are also better at internal details of DSOs. I did a review a while back comparing TV Panoptics, TV and Vixen Plossls, and BCOs. The BCOs revealed more internal details than the others, the TV Plossls showed fainter features and greater nebula extent. The Panoptics and Vixen Plossls (NPL series) were great in general. There's no one best eyepiece. It depends on the object and what you like.

    I have a few Takahashi eyepieces in the LE series. They are hidden in the "Masuyama" mix in my sig. They're superb. I'm not sure I like the prices for their orthos, though....
    j.gardavsky, Gabby76 and Mayj12 like this.

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    Default Re: Z12 eyepeice, 2 or 3 good starters

    Hello May,

    a rebrand of the KK Fujiyamas HD-OR are the TAKAHASHI MC Abbe (orthos). The lens cells of the both are manufactured in the same plant in Japan, they have just different tubes, the Tak has a better rubber eyeguard and its price is one third up.
    The complication in the manufacturing is when the small lenses become cemented into a triplet. The process is hand made with monitoring the faint Newton rings visible with a light surce under a stereo microscope.

    The BCOs have been designed with larger meniscus-like gaps between the lenses in the triplet, and Baader has found out a formula for easier automated cementing of the triplet with more cement mass between the lens surfaces. Herewith the final price is about one half of the KK, or one third of the Taks, and the manufacturing looks like to happen in Taiwan.

    I am using the 6mm and 10mm BCOs, and with the Baader triplet HT Barlow 2.25x, I can get the 2.7mm, which is great on the bright globular clusters like M13, and with a green filter the details on the Moon are breathtaking. In fact not far behind the very expensive Pentax SMC XO 2.5, which itself costs on the 2nd hand markets as much as a decent telescope.

    Here is pic of the group KK-BCO-BCO-Tak,

    http://www.astronomyforum.net/member...be-orthos.html

    Thanks to the new technologies, you can see that the BCOs are more "eye-friendly" than the other Abbe orthos.

    Regarding the 30mm or 35mm wide or ultrawide eyepieces, I have not been ready to spend much money, and so I am using the ex-military (Swiss Army) Wild Heerbrug, mostly for star hopping, and with the OIII filter for 2 or 3 very large nebulae.

    http://www.astronomyforum.net/member...ide-2inch.html

    It is definitely better to spend the money on big binoculars when looking for the very large DSOs.

    Best,

    JG
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    Default Re: Z12 eyepeice, 2 or 3 good starters

    Quote Originally Posted by not_Fritz_Argelander View Post
    It must have been used harshly if there is pitting. I have that eyepiece as well. It's ok but not great in the Z12. Stars get soft at the edge of field. I find it works better in slower scopes.

    You need at least a good 30mm as a finder and a ~20mm (18 to 22) as a mid range. Those and a good 2x Barlow can get you started. Then you would have exit pupils of 6, 4, 3, and 2mm. A good starting point.
    Thanks, that sounds like the better idea actually. Buy three things to get 4 views. And I can add on the smaller bco, as they are relatively inexpensive compared to the others, shortly after. Like in a month or so. And thanks for the info on the ortho. I was reading with my faster scope that I'd have to pay premium to get good views. They aren't that bad really. I can only find them in 6 and 10. I'm assuming that's all they make? Yes, just found it. Those and the 18mm. I can fill in with other brands. Thanks for the info. I've learned a lot between this and going to find the things everyone has suggested and reading up on it. I always try and do my research first. Maybe I over analyze. I just hate buying things that don't work. I also have the mind set of buy once, cry once.

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    Default Re: Z12 eyepeice, 2 or 3 good starters

    Quote Originally Posted by j.gardavsky View Post
    Hello May,

    a rebrand of the KK Fujiyamas HD-OR are the TAKAHASHI MC Abbe (orthos). The lens cells of the both are manufactured in the same plant in Japan, they have just different tubes, the Tak has a better rubber eyeguard and its price is one third up.
    The complication in the manufacturing is when the small lenses become cemented into a triplet. The process is hand made with monitoring the faint Newton rings visible with a light surce under a stereo microscope.

    The BCOs have been designed with larger meniscus-like gaps between the lenses in the triplet, and Baader has found out a formula for easier automated cementing of the triplet with more cement mass between the lens surfaces. Herewith the final price is about one half of the KK, or one third of the Taks, and the manufacturing looks like to happen in Taiwan.

    I am using the 6mm and 10mm BCOs, and with the Baader triplet HT Barlow 2.25x, I can get the 2.7mm, which is great on the bright globular clusters like M13, and with a green filter the details on the Moon are breathtaking. In fact not far behind the very expensive Pentax SMC XO 2.5, which itself costs on the 2nd hand markets as much as a decent telescope.

    Here is pic of the group KK-BCO-BCO-Tak,

    http://www.astronomyforum.net/member...be-orthos.html

    Thanks to the new technologies, you can see that the BCOs are more "eye-friendly" than the other Abbe orthos.

    Regarding the 30mm or 35mm wide or ultrawide eyepieces, I have not been ready to spend much money, and so I am using the ex-military (Swiss Army) Wild Heerbrug, mostly for star hopping, and with the OIII filter for 2 or 3 very large nebulae.

    http://www.astronomyforum.net/member...ide-2inch.html

    It is definitely better to spend the money on big binoculars when looking for the very large DSOs.

    Best,

    JG
    Thanks, you and the other posters have really made it easier for me. Well, guiding me in a direction and putting my mind at ease on my purchases. I hate having buyers remorse, especially if what I got is a piece of crap. I said to someone else I go by buy once, cry once. Although if I can find a good deal I will. I don't mind paying for good stuff, just a long as it works. But to me, looking at the others I've been looking at, the bco are a bargain relatively speaking. I never knew how fast this could get expensive lol. I looked into astrophotography..... for about 5 seconds haha. Now that's the money haha. Still want to get into it. But now I can save and build a budget. Thanks for all the pointers.

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    Default Re: Z12 eyepeice, 2 or 3 good starters

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayj12 View Post
    Buy three things to get 4 views.
    Actually if you got this 2" Barlow https://www.highpointscientific.com/...-by-high-point ,you can remove the bottom element and directly attach it to a 2" EP for an additional 1.3x so you get three lengths with each EP so you would end up with six different lengths with the two EPs.

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    Default Re: Z12 eyepeice, 2 or 3 good starters

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayj12 View Post
    Thanks, that sounds like the better idea actually. Buy three things to get 4 views. And I can add on the smaller bco, as they are relatively inexpensive compared to the others, shortly after. Like in a month or so. And thanks for the info on the ortho. I was reading with my faster scope that I'd have to pay premium to get good views. They aren't that bad really. I can only find them in 6 and 10. I'm assuming that's all they make? Yes, just found it. Those and the 18mm. I can fill in with other brands. Thanks for the info. I've learned a lot between this and going to find the things everyone has suggested and reading up on it. I always try and do my research first. Maybe I over analyze. I just hate buying things that don't work. I also have the mind set of buy once, cry once.
    Very wise. I like trying gear as much as I like observing. So in almost 65 years of observing and trying different stuff I've learned that cheaping out with a knock off is often not worth it.

    The remarks about Orthos not being good in fast Newtonians only apply to older Orthoscopics using ancient types of optical glass. The Baader and KK lines use more modern glass and are terrific performers in my Z12. The only reason I keep the Delos set is that sometimes I want a wider afov to frame an object. For the details the orthoscopics beat the Delos out by just a little. So the extra money spent on the Delos is only for the wider field and better eye relief.

    The whole BCO Q-turret set gives you 4 eyepieces and a dual use barlow that works at 1.3x and 2.25x. So that kit gives you 12 possible magnifications. It's the best deal on optics that are keepers out there IMO.
    Last edited by not_Fritz_Argelander; 07-16-2019 at 06:04 PM.

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    Default Re: Z12 eyepeice, 2 or 3 good starters

    I have a full set of UO HD & KK Othos and I don't use them in my 8" manual Dob. I find it bothersome to try and keep the image in the narrow FOV that the Othos have.

    I prefer EPs that have a larger FOV (62* - 100*) for that scope.

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