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Thread: SWaB: (he uses the S word obnoxiously)

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    Default SWaB: (he uses the S word obnoxiously)





    https://www.forbes.com/sites/startsw...Y#59ebb0df22d9

    Better than usual, it's clearer than usual that singularities are mathematical artifacts of incomplete theories.
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    Default Re: SWaB: (he uses the S word obnoxiously)

    Thanks n_FA. Why is it that everyone talks about the center of a BH as being very small? Why can't it be a very dense, and possibly large object, that because of it's gravitational pull does not let light out?
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    Default Re: SWaB: (he uses the S word obnoxiously)

    Quote Originally Posted by michael131313 View Post
    Thanks n_FA. Why is it that everyone talks about the center of a BH as being very small? Why can't it be a very dense, and possibly large object, that because of it's gravitational pull does not let light out?
    In the physical world that’s what it would be. In Einstein’s equations it’s a point. Maybe more later.
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    Default Re: SWaB: (he uses the S word obnoxiously)

    Doesn't a singularity violate the Pauli exclusion principle and plank length?
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    Default Re: SWaB: (he uses the S word obnoxiously)

    Quote Originally Posted by smeyer8015 View Post
    Doesn't a singularity violate the Pauli exclusion principle and plank length?
    The idea of a point singularity happens in GR only when you ignore quantum physics. The Planck length says that GR is incomplete and incompetent for any smaller length. Hence my annoyance with abuse of the term.
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    Default Re: SWaB: (he uses the S word obnoxiously)

    Quote Originally Posted by michael131313 View Post
    Thanks n_FA. Why is it that everyone talks about the center of a BH as being very small? Why can't it be a very dense, and possibly large object, that because of it's gravitational pull does not let light out?
    Quote Originally Posted by not_Fritz_Argelander View Post
    In the physical world that's what it would be. In Einstein’s equations it's a point. Maybe more later.
    Here it is, a bit later and a little more.

    A dense stable object at the center of a BH would have to be in hydrostatic equilibrium. It would be larger than a Planck mass so the Tolman-Openheimer-Volkoff equations that apply to hydrostatic equilibrium in GR would apply. As a result you have the same stability / instability considerations that apply to the maximum masses of white dwarfs (the Chandrasekhar limit is the Newtonian approximation to the maximum mass of a white dwarf supported by electron degeneracy pressure) and neutron stars (the TOV limit is the maximum mass of a neutron star supported by neutron degeneracy pressure). These TOV limits are on the order of only a few solar masses so you need something else at the center to be stable.

    While there has been some speculation about quark degeneracy pressure supporting quark stars (specifically strange quarks) that doesn't help much.

    That is why things collapse to a black hole and there is no matter pressure-density relationship that can resist the collapse.

    It is only when you go to a non GR gravitational theory that you can get a hint, even without quantum gravity, of how this might work.

    In Einstein-Cartan-Sciama-Kibble gravity (ECSK) space time has torsion (in GR spacetime has zero torsion). This torsion couples directly to particle spin creating a repulsion that dominates the attraction from the torsion free part of the metric. Thus the stability of dense masses inside BHs is guaranteed and there is no singularity at the Big Bang or rather Big Bounce.

    ECSK gravity also satisfies ALL tests of GR so it is a completely viable alternative gravity theory.
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    Default Re: SWaB: (he uses the S word obnoxiously)

    Thanks very much n_FA. I appreciate it.
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