Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: Pre big bang

  1. #1
    manjumadhav93's Avatar
    manjumadhav93 is offline White Dwarf
    Points: 187, Level: 3
    Level completed: 74%, Points required for next Level: 13
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    2 Posts Achievement
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    India
    Posts
    1
    Points
    187
    Level
    3
    Thanks
    8
    Thanked 0x 0 Posts

    Default Pre big bang



    Sir my question is what really existed in the universe before the big bang.So how did the matter originated.If we assume in the Pre big bang universe nothing existed in the universe except space and time.How can matter or atomic particles come into existence(Because nothing can come out from nothing).
    My second question is Does infinite past make any sense.What is the origin of time?Does Time travel into past is possible?Is it possible for us to travel more than the speed of light?What are wormholes and cosmic strings?Does negative energy exists?If yes,Explain me how?
    Thank you and i will be awaiting for your reply.

  2. #2
    pikaia's Avatar
    pikaia is offline SUPER GIANT
    Points: 16,454, Level: 88
    Level completed: 59%, Points required for next Level: 146
    Overall activity: 4.0%
    Achievements:
    50 Posts Achievement!5 Threads Achievement!2 Posts Achievement20 Posts Achievement!200+ Posts Achievement!
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Liverpool, England
    Posts
    1,250
    Points
    16,454
    Level
    88
    Thanks
    1,406
    Thanked 1,766x 612 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by manjumadhav93 View Post
    Sir my question is what really existed in the universe before the big bang.So how did the matter originated.If we assume in the Pre big bang universe nothing existed in the universe except space and time.How can matter or atomic particles come into existence(Because nothing can come out from nothing).
    Hi manjumadhav93,
    It is not true that "nothing can come out from nothing", we know that particles come existence spontaneously ("Quantum Fluctuation"). It takes energy for the particles to remain in existence, but this energy can be provided by gravity, because a gravitational field has negative energy, which exactly balances the energy of the particles. When matter was created soon after the Big Bang, particles were somehow created at the expense of gravity. The total energy of the Universe is zero!

    "A Universe from Nothing" by Lawrence Krauss goes into more detail.

  3. The Following User Says Thank You to pikaia For This Useful Post:

    manjumadhav93 (04-22-2012)

  4. #3
    OleCuss's Avatar
    OleCuss is offline Curmudgeon
    Points: 61,609, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 47.0%
    Achievements:
    200+ Posts Achievement!First 1000 Experience Points400+ Posts Achievement365 Days+ Registered Achievement!Got three Friends
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Central California, USA
    Posts
    12,079
    Points
    61,609
    Level
    100
    Thanks
    2,213
    Thanked 5,442x 3,560 Posts

    Default

    A little bit more? According to Big Bang cosmology, Space-Time did not exist prior to the Big Bang. Really, there was simply nothing at all in the profound sense that we can't even define something before the Big Bang because there was nothing to define.

    The most attractive theory I've heard of what might have existed prior to the Big Bang is that it was another universe. The idea is that as our universe expands over many billions of years that matter sort of disintegrates in to photons and the photons themselves sort of degenerate to the point that the concept of space-time sort of disappears and an infinite universe could also be defined as an infinitesimal universe - and there is another Big Bang! So you end up with a sort of Bang-Bang-Bang theory but not in the sense that the universe ever collapses.

    I think there are some potentially seriously problematic issues with that theory - including that there's no way to test it. The other problem is that it would seem to suggest that there is a sort of continuity from one universe (or Bang) to another in that they might have to all have similar mixes of matter, energy, etc. so that they can expand to the point of being infinitesimal - and I'm not at all sure that such continuity would make sense.

    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
    XX12G and XT8; 10 inch LX200GPS;
    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
    8SE; Tele Vue NP-101is (Petzval apochromat); Meade LS-8; WO GT-71; AVX and Losmandy G-11 mounts.

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to OleCuss For This Useful Post:

    manjumadhav93 (04-22-2012)

  6. #4
    Voyager3's Avatar
    Voyager3 is offline HYPER GIANT
    Points: 14,604, Level: 83
    Level completed: 30%, Points required for next Level: 246
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    Ghost Achievement! Averaging 5+ posts a day!200+ Posts Achievement!400+ Posts AchievementFirst 1000 Experience Points50 Posts Achievement!
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Montreal
    Posts
    2,211
    Points
    14,604
    Level
    83
    Thanks
    1,226
    Thanked 849x 646 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by OleCuss View Post
    ...According to Big Bang cosmology, Space-Time did not exist prior to the Big Bang...
    That's exactly how the BB theory was explained to me:
    No space = no time = no "before".

    Personnal observation: I find it ironic that most North Americans, who could care less about anything that preceded their own self-centered existence (just ask high school students to rate their history class), suddenly become interested when it comes to what preceded the Big Bang...13.7 billion years ago.
    C-800 Edge HD |TV 101| ES ED80 | WO ZS66 SD | Coronado PST | SW 130 Dob | B & L 8080 | ST-80 |
    Nexstar 8SE l EQ-5 l EQ3-2 l EQ-1 l AZ-3 | Vixen Mini-Porta l
    ES 7.6mm & 16mm | Nagler 9mm | Panoptic 24mm | TV 32mm & 40mm Plössl |

    “The history of astronomy is a history of receding horizons.”
    ― Edwin Hubble

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to Voyager3 For This Useful Post:

    manjumadhav93 (04-22-2012)

  8. #5
    pikaia's Avatar
    pikaia is offline SUPER GIANT
    Points: 16,454, Level: 88
    Level completed: 59%, Points required for next Level: 146
    Overall activity: 4.0%
    Achievements:
    50 Posts Achievement!5 Threads Achievement!2 Posts Achievement20 Posts Achievement!200+ Posts Achievement!
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Liverpool, England
    Posts
    1,250
    Points
    16,454
    Level
    88
    Thanks
    1,406
    Thanked 1,766x 612 Posts

    Default

    I have never understood why people ever equated the BB with the beginning of time, and I dislike the idea of time having a beginning. It probably extends to infinity in the forward direction, so why not in the reverse direction? That is why I am biased in favour of Loop Quantum Gravity, which avoids the problem of infinite density, and posits a pre-BB universe which collapses and rebounds.

    http://richarddawkins.net/articles/3...rse-39-s-birth

  9. The Following User Says Thank You to pikaia For This Useful Post:

    manjumadhav93 (04-22-2012)

  10. #6
    jrkirkham's Avatar
    jrkirkham is offline HYPER GIANT
    Points: 34,343, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 4.0%
    Achievements:
    200+ Posts Achievement!First 1000 Experience Points365 Days+ Registered Achievement!Visitor Messenger Achievement!Got three Friends
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Illinois, USA
    Posts
    2,793
    Points
    34,343
    Level
    100
    Thanks
    1,042
    Thanked 1,527x 887 Posts

    Default

    For some I think it is just the opposite. I think some people care a great deal about what came before us. Before the big bang we have no space, no time, no matter, no existence, yet multiple theories that change from decade to decade. Sometimes we fight for our theories, but we don't have the tools to prove them. It is almost like the Big Bang is the horizon which science can't cross. We have faith that perhaps one day we will cross it and put tremendous efforts into crossing it, but the closer we get, it remains as elusive as ever, except for refined theories, which continue to evolve. It's a place we want to go, but perhaps cannot go, yet, given time, science should be able to explain almost anything. It is a threshold enigma that holds the answers to some of our biggest questions. Then to make matters worse, we all fight with great certainty about the answers which we all believe, but none of us have. It is a messy question.
    Rob
    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.


    Current Projects: nothing organized, just preparing for retirement in a few years
    Main Scopes: Orion XT10, Dob / ES ED80T / Orion 90mm Mak-Cass / 50 mm Galileoscope refractor / Celestron 8" SCT / Orion Sirius Mount / Various cameras and lenses

  11. The Following User Says Thank You to jrkirkham For This Useful Post:

    manjumadhav93 (04-22-2012)

  12. #7
    Motorcycle Jack's Avatar
    Motorcycle Jack is offline Main Sequence
    Points: 1,022, Level: 18
    Level completed: 22%, Points required for next Level: 78
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    50 Posts Achievement!5 Threads Achievement!2 Posts Achievement20 Posts Achievement!365 Days+ Registered Achievement!
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    On the road, full time
    Posts
    55
    Points
    1,022
    Level
    18
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 18x 11 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pikaia View Post
    I have never understood why people ever equated the BB with the beginning of time, and I dislike the idea of time having a beginning.
    I think it has to do with the popularity of the miss understanding of the Hubble equation. They think that as something approaches the zero point in velocity and expansion, that it must eventually not exist. Me, I prefer to think of it as Hawkins does. Information (the universe and it's elements) exist in many dimensions and universes. As it comes into existence in one universe, it ceases in another. As it ceases in one, bang () it exists in another.

  13. The Following User Says Thank You to Motorcycle Jack For This Useful Post:

    manjumadhav93 (04-22-2012)

  14. #8
    Joe Lalumia's Avatar
    Joe Lalumia is offline HYPER GIANT
    Points: 61,001, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    200+ Posts Achievement!Ghost Achievement! Averaging 5+ posts a day!Got three FriendsFirst 1000 Experience Points20+ Friends Achievement!
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Quinlan, Texas
    Posts
    10,947
    Points
    61,001
    Level
    100
    Thanks
    6,772
    Thanked 5,156x 3,400 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    The answer to your question is simply NO ONE knows what came before the BB or before TIME and SPACE began.

    Clear skies.
    ETX 125PE, Stellarvue 80mm BV & Televue TelePod tripod,
    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
    8" LNT, 10x50, 15x70mm binoculars, Stellarvue binoviewers, solar filters for all three
    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
    ..... plus a bunch of ham radios... Ham radio call sign - W1XWX

    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.

    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.


    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
    TelescopeMan Web Site

    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
    search for W1XWX to see my amateur radio web site

    "If you can't explain it to a six year old, you don't understand it yourself.” - Albert Einstein

    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.

  15. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Joe Lalumia For This Useful Post:

    jes29651 (04-22-2012),jrkirkham (04-21-2012),manjumadhav93 (04-22-2012),OleCuss (04-21-2012)

  16. #9
    MitchAlsup's Avatar
    MitchAlsup is offline SUPER GIANT
    Points: 5,847, Level: 52
    Level completed: 49%, Points required for next Level: 103
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    200+ Posts Achievement!First 1000 Experience Points400+ Posts Achievement50 Posts Achievement!365 Days+ Registered Achievement!
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Austin Texas
    Posts
    1,066
    Points
    5,847
    Level
    52
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 505x 381 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by manjumadhav93 View Post
    Sir my question is what really existed in the universe before the big bang.
    Nothing that we have any real idea of what it might be. The current theories concentrate on two Brains making contact and yielding energy into the BB.

    So how did the matter originated.
    matter is just condensed energy:: m = e/c**2

    If we assume in the Pre big bang universe nothing existed in the universe except space and time.
    Neither space NOR time existed before the BB.

    How can matter or atomic particles come into existence(Because nothing can come out from nothing).
    Matter condensed out of the energy, and the energy was "made available" in the first attoseconds of the BB.

    My second question is Does infinite past make any sense.
    The past is bounded at 13.77 Bilion years. This is when time attained its current properties at the instant of the BB.

    What is the origin of time?
    An excellent question--that no one knows the anser to.

    Does Time travel into past is possible?
    About 5 years ago it was proven (mathematically) that if you could build a time machine, you could not use it to go backwards in time prior to when the time machiine was built. This proof contradicts your premis.

    Is it possible for us to travel more than the speed of light?
    Maybe. What is not possible is to accelerate through the speed of light. But if there were a way to simply go from normal velocities to superluminial velocities instantly, it might be possible to remain at superluminal velocities for a while.

    What are wormholes and cosmic strings?
    A wormhole is a tunnel from one part of space-time to another part of spacetime that has the property that the distance through the tunnel is far shorter than the distance from one opening to another.

    Cosmic strings are the basis for a number of Theories of everything currently being studies in cosmological theoretical studies.

    Does negative energy exists?If yes,Explain me how?
    Maybe. There is an energy that has been measured that has the property that it pushes everything away from it. This is the source of the acceleration of the galaxies vast distances away from us. You can look at this energy source as increasing the energy of the universe (more mass traveling at higher velocities (i.e. positive energy)) or you can look at this as counteracting the forces of gravity that were originally thought to be decelerating distant galaxies (where it takes on a negative form). Since both must be true simultaneously, this indicates something in the physics is incorrect.

    But what?

  17. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to MitchAlsup For This Useful Post:

    manjumadhav93 (04-22-2012),OleCuss (04-21-2012)

 

 

Similar Threads

  1. Big bang
    By nike_nikup in forum Astrophysics Forum
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 09-11-2008, 08:14 PM
  2. B, Big, Big Bang, Big Bang Books...
    By socalsw in forum Amateur Astronomy Forum
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 06-07-2004, 08:17 AM
  3. big bang?
    By Zdenek Jizba in forum General Astronomy Forum
    Replies: 48
    Last Post: 03-07-2004, 09:00 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.0
Powered by vBulletin®
All times are GMT. The time now is 08:54 AM.