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Thread: Preparing my first shoot for tonight

  1. #1
    Steve_E's Avatar
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    Default Preparing my first shoot for tonight



    forum.jpgforum.jpg

    I won't go into it too far incase it's all just a mess (first tries just have to be)

    To prepare I took this picture, it's a power pole about 160 meters away, hot day

    Using the Nikon D3000 (a very very average camera as we know) with a 10 eyepiece (will be using a 25 tonight), so just sorting out a focus

    Camera is attached using the correct parts direct into the scope

    I have no tracking device so will be taking 8 second shots and stacking

    It's all just exciting and I'm prepared for the worst, I expect it so nothing can daunt me in this, there is nothing negative

    but I won't be posting rubbish, it may be a long time before a picture is seen by this member
    I didn't use stacking for the power pole, perhaps I should of.

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    Default Re: Preparing my first shoot for tonight

    All right Steve, you can't just leave us hanging. How did it go?

    Also, if you'd list your equipment in the "signature" area of your profile, it would fill in the "blanks" in our following your astro-adventure.

    Cheers,

    Bob
    6 inch F/5 GEM mounted reflector

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    >)))))*>

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    Default Re: Preparing my first shoot for tonight

    Well Bob I hate to be negative, but why not as there were no actual positives

    It turns out after doing at least 100 shots of the moon that the camera lives up to its name (or this user), the moon shots were below average, even compared to my cheap web cam the web cam was far clearer with more detail through the scope (will add equipment to sig shortly)

    This was far worse than I thought and I thought it would be far better than before, here's my best moon shot and that was after doing everything I could in photoshop, it can not get better so I'll give up with the moon and go more skywood. And I did

    I took around 100 8 second shots wide angle of Orion with no scope, set the camera to 50mm and hit the remote.
    I stacked them...to what end I wondered after spending the time, still it's all good and I'm glad I didn't have anything to show for it, all expected so the challenge continues, strangely the end stacked image looked just like any single shot taken

    Ah so much to look forward to (smile)
    I did upload rubbish

    DSC_0326a.jpg

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    Default Re: Preparing my first shoot for tonight

    Scope: AQUIZA 90mm F500
    tripod, celestron 3x Barlow, celestron 8x24 zoom eyepiece, 25mm, 10mm Lens'
    Camera
    Nikon D3000, Shutter Remote, Nikon DX AF-S NIKKOR 18-70mm, 1:3.5-45G EQ Lens
    BobDob likes this.
    Scope: AQUIZA 90mm F500
    Allview Mount, celestron 3x
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    , celestron 8x24 zoom
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    , 25mm, 10mm Lens'
    Camera Nikon D3000, Nikon D5100 Shutter Remote, Nikon DX AF-S NIKKOR 18-70mm, 1:3.5-45G EQ Lens, Nikon 35mm 1/1.8

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    BobDob (11-02-2014)

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    Default Re: Preparing my first shoot for tonight

    Honestly, it's rather hard from your dialog to determine 1) What you Did; 2) What you Disliked about the Results; and 3) What might have actually Gone Wrong...

    Perhaps we can start with some basic details about your Setup and your Approach to the Image Capture for the Moon (which isn't that bad - just somewhat Overexposed in areas).

    Your Scope is unfamiliar - couldn't find any references on Google. Is it a Refractor ?? What Focal Length (assuming the "90mm" is the Aperture) ??
    Are you connecting the DSLR to the Scope at Prime Focus ?? Or using the more complex Afocal or Projection setups ??

    Your Image Processing is also not covered in detail except mention of Stacking and Photoshop.
    Are you working with RAW images ?? Or converted TIFF or JPG ??
    What software are you using for Stacking ?? DSS ?? RegiStax6 ?? Other ?? Or manually within PhotoShop ??

    If you stick with it, and stick with the Forum, we'll likely be able to help you make sense of the involved processes and give you countless pointers to build your skills...
    BobDob likes this.
    ES AR152 / ES 80ED Apo / Orion 8in F/3.9 / C9.25-SCT / C6-SCT / C10-NGT / AT6RC / ST-80 / AstroView 90 / Meade 6000 APO 115mm
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    Default Re: Preparing my first shoot for tonight

    To give some perspective on results I would like to do this, do click on each picture for some outstanding results
    https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/...QxNDkxMTMzOA--

    Siegell, thanks for noticing

    Honestly, it's rather hard from your dialog to determine 1) What you Did; 2) What you Disliked about the Results; and 3) What might have actually Gone Wrong...

    As for results, it's all about expectations, mine are realistic but I fear not achievable with the gear I have, that picture is as close to terrible as my expectations realized

    Perhaps we can start with some basic details about your Setup and your Approach to the Image Capture for the Moon (which isn't that bad - just somewhat Overexposed in areas).
    It's very blurry even after P'Shop unmask sharpening, there are bad lights at the edges yes my scope can give a beautiful sharp eye image of Saturn so it's capable, it's a 90mm refractor that cost $1000.00

    Your Scope is unfamiliar - couldn't find any references on Google. Is it a Refractor ?? What Focal Length (assuming the "90mm" is the Aperture) ??
    Are you connecting the DSLR to the Scope at Prime Focus ?? Or using the more complex Afocal or Projection setups ??
    I'm not sure what Prime focus is so I've attached a picture of the setup

    Your Image Processing is also not covered in detail except mention of Stacking and Photoshop.
    Are you working with RAW images ?? Or converted TIFF or JPG ??

    I did set the camera for Raw and jpegs, I used jpegs
    What software are you using for Stacking ?? DSS ?? RegiStax6 ?? Other ?? Or manually within PhotoShop ??
    I have RegiStax 6, I've been through the youtube tutorials

    If you stick with it, and stick with the Forum, we'll likely be able to help you make sense of the involved processes and give you countless pointers to build your skills...

    I'm not one to annoy to get others to teach me the learning curve needed but I never say no to those who know

    IMG_20141102_205154.jpgIMG_20141102_205226.jpgIMG_20141102_205328.jpgIMG_20141102_205655.jpgIMG_20141102_205755.jpg
    Scope: AQUIZA 90mm F500
    Allview Mount, celestron 3x
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    , celestron 8x24 zoom
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    , 25mm, 10mm Lens'
    Camera Nikon D3000, Nikon D5100 Shutter Remote, Nikon DX AF-S NIKKOR 18-70mm, 1:3.5-45G EQ Lens, Nikon 35mm 1/1.8

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    Default Re: Preparing my first shoot for tonight

    Thanks for the pictures but it's still not telling us enough. The first picture looks like an eyepiece projection adapter with a W10X microscope eyepiece in it. It is not clear from the pictures how you attached your camera to the telescope. It looks like you attached it to the diagonal using the eyepiece projection adapter (but here I am already guessing twice). If it is a microscope eyepiece, very few of us are familiar with them. Very few are also familiar with eyepiece projection so not sure if we can help.

    Anyway looking at your moon shot, it is blurry. First off, the angle is about 1 degree diagonally, based on that you must have used a focal length of about 1500 mm. For that focal length you cannot use 8 second exposure time. The rule of thumb for a fixed tripod is 500 divided by the focal length so that would have been 1/3 of a second. What exposure time did you use? Obviously it was not 8 seconds because there are no streaks but you did not mention the exposure time.

    How did you focus? This is something that went wrong I think. If you used the same focal settings as with your daytime picture, be aware that 160 m is not far enough away to be considered infinity. You should take a series of pictures of the moon, zoom in on the results, adjust the focus, repeat until you have sharp focus. For the moon usually 1/100th of a second is enough but that depends on the F ratio that we don't know.

    In your daytime picture I can already see a good deal of chromatic aberration, to the point where that setup will never yield pictures as sharp as the ones in your link (those are excellent BTW, a quality that very few of us can achieve). So at night it won't get any better, even with the right focus. Here we have to wonder about a few things: What telescope are you using? I am guessing an Aquila 90500 but that should cost $200 at the most (not $1000, that is how much an Apo would cost), this could be a reason for the CA. What setup did you use, if it was eyepiece projection, could the eyepiece cause the CA? Is your diagonal solid enough to support all that weight? It does not take much of an angle to cause problems, a safer way would be to use no diagonal.
    ... Henk. Telescopes: 6" Mak-Newt (Comet Hunter), ES ED127CF, ES ED80, Zhumell Z12, Coulter Odyssey 10, AT6RC, Venture RX-7, Celestron Skymaster 20x80, Mounts and tripod: Losmandy G11S, AVX, LXD55, Tiltall, Cameras: Fuji X-a1, Canon SX40, Xt, XSi, T6, ELPH 100HS, DIY: Dob and camera barndoor trackers, afocal adapter, Dob with foldable base and Az/Alt setting circles, Accessories: SSAG, Plossls, Barlows, Telrad, laser collimators (Seben LK1, Z12, Howie Glatter), Cheshire, 2 Orion RACIs 8x50, Software: DSS, ImageMagick, PHD, Nebulosity, Photo Gallery, Gimp, CHDK

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    Default Re: Preparing my first shoot for tonight

    Quote Originally Posted by CamelHat View Post
    Anyway looking at your moon shot, it is blurry. First off, the angle is about 1 degree diagonally, based on that you must have used a focal length of about 1500 mm. For that focal length you cannot use 8 second exposure time. The rule of thumb for a fixed tripod is 500 divided by the focal length so that would have been 1/3 of a second. What exposure time did you use? Obviously it was not 8 seconds because there are no streaks but you did not mention the exposure time.
    Reading the OP's description, it seems the Moon image was actually shot with his Nikon DX AF-S NIKKOR 18-70mm 1:3.5-45G EQ Lens Camera Lens set at 50mm - making the 8sec exposure quite plausible and explaining the lack of sharpness due to the extreme crop necessary for the final image.
    ES AR152 / ES 80ED Apo / Orion 8in F/3.9 / C9.25-SCT / C6-SCT / C10-NGT / AT6RC / ST-80 / AstroView 90 / Meade 6000 APO 115mm
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    Default Re: Preparing my first shoot for tonight

    Quote Originally Posted by CamelHat View Post
    What telescope are you using? I am guessing an Aquila 90500 but that should cost $200 at the most (not $1000, that is how much an Apo would cost), this could be a reason for the CA.
    My Google Searches came up with the same resulting Scope... There aren't too many Reviews posted of the Aquila 90500 (nor of the multitude of other brands under which the same scope is sold), but it looks to be a medium quality Air-Spaced Doublet Achromat (we get a lot of similar 80mm f/5 and f/6 in the US and Europe) with a decent 1:10 Focuser. Nothing is wrong with this Scope - but one will need to remember that it is an Achromat and will have some decent amount of Chromatic Aberration and Field Curvature which come with that design. None of this will defeat any AP Imaging efforts...
    I won't comment much on the Price (neither the potential value in the USA nor the additional costs incurred in more remote markets such as Kiwi-land) - but if you add in a few eyepieces and adapters and T-Ring then the quoted price might be more what we'd see in our markets.
    ES AR152 / ES 80ED Apo / Orion 8in F/3.9 / C9.25-SCT / C6-SCT / C10-NGT / AT6RC / ST-80 / AstroView 90 / Meade 6000 APO 115mm
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    Default Re: Preparing my first shoot for tonight

    Quote Originally Posted by seigell View Post
    Reading the OP's description, it seems the Moon image was actually shot with his Nikon DX AF-S NIKKOR 18-70mm 1:3.5-45G EQ Lens Camera Lens set at 50mm - making the 8sec exposure quite plausible and explaining the lack of sharpness due to the extreme crop necessary for the final image.
    Actually I thought this was from the 1st message: That was a picture comprising (I guess) an image of about 1 m diagonal at 160 m so an angle of 0.36 degrees taken with a 10 mm eyepiece. This would become a 0.72 degrees with the 25 mm as mentioned, just about right, which is also why I was assuming that the moon image was the whole sensor frame. Regardless of how the image was achieved, the resulting angle is the same so the exposure time limitations are the same as well, cropped or direct at 1500 mm. More information would be good. And yes an achromat should be adequate, postprocessing could help with sharpening the result.
    ... Henk. Telescopes: 6" Mak-Newt (Comet Hunter), ES ED127CF, ES ED80, Zhumell Z12, Coulter Odyssey 10, AT6RC, Venture RX-7, Celestron Skymaster 20x80, Mounts and tripod: Losmandy G11S, AVX, LXD55, Tiltall, Cameras: Fuji X-a1, Canon SX40, Xt, XSi, T6, ELPH 100HS, DIY: Dob and camera barndoor trackers, afocal adapter, Dob with foldable base and Az/Alt setting circles, Accessories: SSAG, Plossls, Barlows, Telrad, laser collimators (Seben LK1, Z12, Howie Glatter), Cheshire, 2 Orion RACIs 8x50, Software: DSS, ImageMagick, PHD, Nebulosity, Photo Gallery, Gimp, CHDK

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