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  1. #1
    S. Caro's Avatar
    S. Caro Guest

    Default If AGW is real, why would the main players delete data?



    If anyone has taken the time to read the e-mail and other documents
    that were hacked from the Hadley Climate Research Unit, they will have
    seen documents from prominent scientists asking others to erase
    certain findings. Not ALL findings, just CERTAIN findings...
    (Note that these documents have been authenticated).

    The link below shows ONE of these e-mails

    http://wattsupwiththat.com/2009/11/1...iles-released/

    -------------------------
    From: Phil Jones
    To: mann@xxx
    Subject: Fwd: CCNet: PRESSURE GROWING ON CONTROVERSIAL RESEARCHER TO DISCLOSE SECRET DATA
    Date: Mon Feb 21 16:28:32 2005
    Cc: “raymond s. bradley” , “Malcolm Hughes”

    Mike, Ray and Malcolm,
    The skeptics seem to be building up a head of steam here ! Maybe we can use
    this to our advantage to get the series updated !
    Odd idea to update the proxies with satellite estimates of the lower troposphere
    rather than surface data !. Odder still that they don’t realise that Moberg et al used the
    Jones and Moberg updated series !
    Francis Zwiers is till onside. He said that PC1s produce hockey sticks. He stressed
    that the late 20th century is the warmest of the millennium, but Regaldo didn’t bother
    with that. Also ignored Francis’ comment about all the other series looking similar
    to MBH.
    The IPCC comes in for a lot of stick.
    Leave it to you to delete as appropriate !
    Cheers
    Phil
    PS I’m getting hassled by a couple of people to release the CRU station temperature data.
    Don’t any of you three tell anybody that the UK has a Freedom of Information Act !
    ----------------------------

    Why would scientists be worried about releasing data and the freedom of
    information act? This obviously doesn't prove the Hadley CRUT is wrong, but
    it certainly bringsinto question some their credibility.

    It appears that someone in the UK has discovered the freedom of information
    act.

    With all the raw data gone, the findings can no longer be confirmed or denied.
    This leaves the world to accept all the global warming graphs and documents on
    faith alone.

    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle6936328.ece

    ---------------------------
    Climate change data dumped

    "SCIENTISTS at the University of East Anglia (UEA) have admitted throwing
    away much of the raw temperature data on which their predictions of global
    warming are based.

    It means that other academics are not able to check basic calculations
    said to show a long-term rise in temperature over the past 150 years".
    ---------------------------
    ....



  2. #2
    Chris L Peterson's Avatar
    Chris L Peterson Guest

    Default If AGW is real, why would the main players delete data?

    On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 15:53:32 -0600, "S. Caro" <scaro@muxnet.com> wrote:


    There's nothing there that looks like a suggestion to delete any data.
    In fact, I've seen very little in any of the released emails to suggest
    any sort of hiding of data or scientifically suspect actions. There's
    nothing there but political ammo; it doesn't change the overall quality
    of climate research, nor the obvious conclusion that AGW is a real
    phenomenon.
    _________________________________________________

    Chris L Peterson
    Cloudbait Observatory
    http://www.cloudbait.com

  3. #3
    David Staup's Avatar
    David Staup Guest

    Default If AGW is real, why would the main players delete data?


    "Chris L Peterson" <clp@alumni.caltech.edu> wrote in message
    news:sgs5h5tcu169lcf2u11t9ib7ot8s7rls49@4ax.com...



    Programmer-written comments inserted into CRU's Fortran code have drawn fire
    as well. The file briffa_sep98_d.pro says: "Apply a VERY ARTIFICAL
    correction for decline!!" and "APPLY ARTIFICIAL CORRECTION." Another,
    quantify_tsdcal.pro, says: "Low pass filtering at century and longer time
    scales never gets rid of the trend - so eventually I start to scale down the
    120-yr low pass time series to mimic the effect of removing/adding longer
    time scales!"

    not scientifically suspect??? maybe not by your standards...chuckle

    lies, damn lies, and statistics.... massage anyone



  4. #4
    S. Caro's Avatar
    S. Caro Guest

    Default If AGW is real, why would the main players delete data?

    Chris L Peterson wrote:


    You haven't read all the e-mails and documents. There are more that point
    to cherry picking, massaging data to fit, choosing peer review panels
    that were sure to concur with their outcomes and refusing to cooperate
    with anyone who disagreed with their findings.

    Since you are a person of great faith, I doubt they would sway you so I
    won't go back and dig up links to post links. (But I'm sure others will do
    this anyway).

    Here's a task. Explain how people of less faith can be ABSOLUTELY certain that
    the uncovered conversations are meaningless and that the Hadley crew has done
    nothing underhanded when it comes to their climate research.

    Prove it unequivocally.



  5. #5
    Sam Wormley's Avatar
    Sam Wormley Guest

    Default If AGW is real, why would the main players delete data?

    S. Caro -- What makes you thing data was deleted?

    Take a look at what's happening around the world.
    I've provided you with links to some good graphic
    of data form many independent sources.

    CO2 increase, Global Temperature increase, Sea Level
    increase, are all consistent with each other. Real
    impact is showing up in agriculture, ecosystems, weather
    patterns, shifting seasons and ice melting.

    The global data CLEARLY shows:

    Human contributed increase in green house gas CO2
    http://edu-observatory.org/olli/800000yrs_CO2.png
    http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2009/10/16/0907094106
    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...1023163513.htm

    Global surface (land and sea) temperature increase
    http://www.pewclimate.org/docUploads...emp-trends.gif

    And accompanying Sea Level Rise
    http://www.wildwildweather.com/forec...level_rise.png

    There are many sources of good data
    http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/data-sources/
    http://lwf.ncdc.noaa.gov/climate-monitoring/index.php

    Here's some data from Iowa State University
    http://www.meteor.iastate.edu/facult...entations.html

    More from University of Iowa
    http://www.engineering.uiowa.edu/fac.../schnoor_j.php

    Franzen - The Chemistry and Physics of Global Climate Change
    http://hfranzen.org/
    http://www.hfranzen.org/Global_Warming.pdf

  6. #6
    Sam Wormley's Avatar
    Sam Wormley Guest

    Default If AGW is real, why would the main players delete data?

    David Staup wrote:


    Here is access to raw data, processed data and program code:
    http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/data-sources/


  7. #7
    Sam Wormley's Avatar
    Sam Wormley Guest

    Default If AGW is real, why would the main players delete data?

    S. Caro wrote:


    Have you read all the e-mails and documents. You smell like a cherry
    (a rotten cherry) picker to me.

    Take a look at what's happening around the world.
    I've provided you with links to some good graphic
    of data form many independent sources.

    CO2 increase, Global Temperature increase, Sea Level
    increase, are all consistent with each other. Real
    impact is showing up in agriculture, ecosystems, weather
    patterns, shifting seasons and ice melting.

    The global data CLEARLY shows:

    Human contributed increase in green house gas CO2
    http://edu-observatory.org/olli/800000yrs_CO2.png
    http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2009/10/16/0907094106
    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...1023163513.htm

    Global surface (land and sea) temperature increase
    http://www.pewclimate.org/docUploads...emp-trends.gif

    And accompanying Sea Level Rise
    http://www.wildwildweather.com/forec...level_rise.png

    There are many sources of good data
    http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/data-sources/
    http://lwf.ncdc.noaa.gov/climate-monitoring/index.php

    Here's some data from Iowa State University
    http://www.meteor.iastate.edu/facult...entations.html

    More from University of Iowa
    http://www.engineering.uiowa.edu/fac.../schnoor_j.php

    Franzen - The Chemistry and Physics of Global Climate Change
    http://hfranzen.org/
    http://www.hfranzen.org/Global_Warming.pdf

  8. #8
    Sam Wormley's Avatar
    Sam Wormley Guest

    Default If AGW is real, why would the main players delete data?

    BradGuth wrote:


    Guth--What data did I present to you that favors the "opposite of AGW"?


  9. #9
    yourmommycalled's Avatar
    yourmommycalled Guest

    Default If AGW is real, why would the main players delete data?

    On Nov 29, 6:40 pm, "David Staup" <dst...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

    Since you claim to be able to read the source. Did you notice that the
    whole section is commented out. Did you see that the whole collection
    isn't being used as part of the analysis programs Nah that would make
    you look stupid Chuckle pretty stupid on your part

  10. #10
    yourmommycalled's Avatar
    yourmommycalled Guest

    Default If AGW is real, why would the main players delete data?

    On Nov 29, 6:54 pm, "S. Caro" <sc...@muxnet.com> wrote:


    First prove that the emails contain anything more than a bunch of
    emails between scientists who are sick and tired being libeled and
    slandered by industry paid shills and clueless morons like you. Then
    explain to me why you are willing to ignore Pat Michaels lying under
    oath before Congress about global warming, why you are willing to
    allow Steve McIntyre lie about the availability of raw tree ring data,
    why you are willing to allow the Heartland Institute offer a $10,00
    reward for anyone to lie about global warming.

 

 
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