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  1. #1
    Liam's Avatar
    Liam Guest

    Default Expanding universe, but crashing galaxies?



    Some time ago, in my questioning the idea of absolute relative position
    in space, my having thought there was a center and an edge to the
    universe, I was shown that the universe is infinite like an infinitely
    thick skin of a balloon ever expanding. And was provided these links
    for explanation.

    http://www.astro.ucla.edu/~wright/nocenter.html
    http://www.astro.ucla.edu/~wright/cosmology_faq.html

    Now I come across an article on badastronomy.com that our galaxy is
    colliding with another galaxy, and that we and the Andromeda galaxy are
    getting closer.

    If our universe is constantly expanding, everything away from each
    other, how is it possible that we've collided with another galaxy and
    we're getting closer to another?

    Thanks for any feedback!
    -Liam


  2. #2
    RMOLLISE's Avatar
    RMOLLISE Guest

    Default Expanding universe, but crashing galaxies?


    Liam wrote:

    Hi:

    On "small" scales--as in our local group of galaxies, etc.--the force
    of gravity is more important than the Hubble Flow, the expansion of the
    universe.

    Peace,
    Rod Mollise
    Author of _Choosing and Using a Schmidt Cassegrain Telescope_
    <http://skywatch.brainiac.com/astroland/index.htm>

    Like SCTs and MCTs?
    Check-out sct-user, the mailing list for CAT fanciers:
    <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sct-user>

    See: <http://journals.aol.com/rmollise/UncleRodsAstroBlog/>
    For Uncle Rod's Astro Blog.


  3. #3
    Michael McCulloch's Avatar
    Michael McCulloch Guest

    Default Expanding universe, but crashing galaxies?

    On 8 May 2006 09:49:29 -0700, "Liam" <news@celticbear.com> wrote:


    Gravity can dominate over short distances.

    The minute variations in the CBR shown in the COBE and WMAP studies
    indicates variations in density that gave rise to local clusters and
    superclusters of galaxies that can be locally gravitationally bound.

    ---
    Michael McCulloch

  4. #4
    Sam Wormley's Avatar
    Sam Wormley Guest

    Default Expanding universe, but crashing galaxies?

    Liam wrote:

    Space is expanding with a current expansion rate of 71 km/s/Mpc, but
    at the local and even super galactic cluster levels, gravity dominates.

  5. #5
    Liam's Avatar
    Liam Guest

    Default Expanding universe, but crashing galaxies?


    RMOLLISE wrote:
    Ah! OK, that makes sense.
    Thanks for the clue-by-four. =)
    -Liam


  6. #6
    oriel36's Avatar
    oriel36 Guest

    Default Expanding universe, but crashing galaxies?


    Liam wrote:

    They are seeing an expanding balloon Universe because the Newtonian
    conceptions were built on the celestial sphere or celestial balloon if
    you like.

    They are looking out at the external galaxies through the celestial
    sphere * therefore no surprise that they are coming up with balloon
    universes !.

    *
    http://www.opencourse.info/astronomy...phere_anim.gif

    This 'balloon' stuff died a quick death over the last few years and it
    is best leave it wither into oblivion.


  7. #7
    Starlord's Avatar
    Starlord Guest

    Default Expanding universe, but crashing galaxies?

    While everything is expanding, it's in all directions at once. Right now a
    dwarft galaxy is being "Eaten?" by ours and is is pulling on the SMC & LMC
    galaxies too. And yest we're on a headlong corse to M31. All you need to do
    is look at the Hubble Deepspace photos, they've found LOTS of galaxies
    crashing into one another.


    --
    The Lone Sidewalk Astronomer of Rosamond

    Telescope Buyers FAQ
    http://home.inreach.com/starlord
    Sidewalk Astronomy
    www.sidewalkastronomy.info
    Astronomy Net Online Gift Shop
    http://www.cafepress.com/astronomy_net
    In Garden Online Gift Shop
    http://www.cafepress.com/ingarden
    Blast Off Online Gift Shop
    http://www.cafepress.com/starlords
    Astro Blog
    http://starlord.bloggerteam.com/




    "Liam" <news@celticbear.com> wrote in message
    news:1147106969.712412.139440@g10g2000cwb.googlegr oups.com...



  8. #8
    Liam's Avatar
    Liam Guest

    Default Expanding universe, but crashing galaxies?


    oriel36 wrote:

    What's the latest, best model to describe the expansion of the
    universe?
    When I once asked "If the universe is like the skin of the balloon, how
    thick is it?"
    I was told "A good guess is one Plack time thick... don't take
    metaphors too literally."
    So I can wrap my head around the idea of the universe "like" an
    expanding balloon skin where the skin is "infinitely" thick, and thus
    the actual sphere idea being moot. Is that what you mean?


  9. #9
    Michael McCulloch's Avatar
    Michael McCulloch Guest

    Default Expanding universe, but crashing galaxies?

    On 8 May 2006 12:15:50 -0700, "Liam" <news@celticbear.com> wrote:


    There is no convenient mental picture to use for the Universe. The
    best we can do is some math and then try some *simplified* mental
    pictures and diagrams that assist in our visualization of certain
    ideas.


    The balloon model is just a visualization used to help understand the
    concepts. It illustrates the "no center" and expansion concepts --
    beyond that it is not useful to analyze. It is not literal and has
    really very little to do with any actual "shape" of the Universe.

    ---
    Michael McCulloch

  10. #10
    RMOLLISE's Avatar
    RMOLLISE Guest

    Default Expanding universe, but crashing galaxies?


    Liam wrote:



    Hi Liam:

    The "Oriole" guy/gal is what's referred to as an "Internet Loon."
    His/her "information" has no connection with reality, and she/he is
    best ignored. ;-)

    Peace,
    Rod Mollise
    Author of _Choosing and Using a Schmidt Cassegrain Telescope_
    <http://skywatch.brainiac.com/astroland/index.htm>

    Like SCTs and MCTs?
    Check-out sct-user, the mailing list for CAT fanciers:
    <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sct-user>

    See: <http://journals.aol.com/rmollise/UncleRodsAstroBlog/>
    For Uncle Rod's Astro Blog.


 

 
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