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  1. #1
    Elysium Fossa's Avatar
    Elysium Fossa Guest

    Default Britains Reaction to NASA's success



    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...2F01%2F11%2Fwm
    ars11.xml&sSheet=%2Fnews%2F2004%2F01%2F11%2Fixworl d.html

    I wonder, if Beagle had succeeded the reaction would have been different, or
    perhaps it's just more anti-American crap in the British press.

    "While saluting Nasa's success in managing to keep their probe intact, Prof
    Pillinger could not help but observe ruefully: "For the price of one of
    their launches, we could have put seven Beagle 2s on Mars."

    ...........but how many of the 7 would have worked? I watched the
    documentaries on Beagles construction and testing. It's not nice to admit,
    but after they had finished they left we with little faith in the project
    succeeding.



  2. #2
    Martin Frey's Avatar
    Martin Frey Guest

    Default Britains Reaction to NASA's success

    "Elysium Fossa" <elysiumfossa@netscape.net> wrote:


    I don't see this as anti US - Pillinger is doing a good job of
    containing his emotions in the face of real personal tragedy: his
    "baby" was always underweight and undernourished (with cash: not with
    ingenuity) and it (probably...) died.

    I share your view of the difficulty in maintaining faith: after the
    airbag failure, more than one test success would be needed to build
    confidence.

    I have posted before on the iron nerves of these guys. Having seen the
    documentaries I was like a jelly when I thought about the probable
    outcome - and its got nowt to do with me.

    --
    Martin Frey
    http://www.hadastro.org.uk
    N 51 02 E 0 47

  3. #3
    Elysium Fossa's Avatar
    Elysium Fossa Guest

    Default Britains Reaction to NASA's success

    >

    I thought the journalists tone and style of writing was more anti-US,
    rather than what Colin Pillinger was supposed to have said.

    The article mentions some the failures NASA has had recently, but fails to
    mention the succeses - of which there are dozens. Also many NASA craft are
    multi-national missions. I believe 3 of Spirits science instruments are
    European.



  4. #4
    Jack Harrison's Avatar
    Jack Harrison Guest

    Default Britains Reaction to NASA's success


    "Elysium Fossa" <elysiumfossa@netscape.net> wrote in message
    news:mZwMb.1839$YV1.999@newsfep4-winn.server.ntli.net...
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...2F01%2F11%2Fwm
    or

    Hold on a second.

    Don't fall into the trap of thinking that the British media is
    anti-American. It is not and nor are ordinary British people. But we are
    certainly vehemently anti-Bush. The media and the public detest Bush.
    However, we Brits must accept some of the blame for this - he's called
    deputy fuehrer Blair. (Or the lap dog)

    Jack





  5. #5
    Martin Frey's Avatar
    Martin Frey Guest

    Default Britains Reaction to NASA's success

    "Elysium Fossa" <elysiumfossa@netscape.net> wrote:


    Mea culpa - too idle to read the Telegraph article. (Usually idle
    anyway, but even the word Telegraph makes my idleness discover new
    depths or perhaps heights)

    --
    Martin Frey
    http://www.hadastro.org.uk
    N 51 02 E 0 47

  6. #6
    Doctor J. Frink's Avatar
    Doctor J. Frink Guest

    Default Britains Reaction to NASA's success

    On Mon, 12 Jan 2004 13:47:09 -0000, Elysium Fossa
    <elysiumfossa@netscape.net> wrote:

    The Mossbauer spectrometer is by the MIMOS group at Mainz Uni, Germany
    and is practically the same as used on Beagle. And the X-ray
    spectrometer is also a German-led instrument.

    There has also been much cooperation between the NASA and Beagle teams
    (not just in the use of Odyssey as a relay). There is healthy rivalry
    but some teams have worked on both missions (some simultaneously), both
    on instruments and the supporting science needed to work on Mars.

    I have always felt that we were all in it together, and whilst it would
    have felt good to show the 'damn yankees' a thing or two it wasn't to be
    on the day. ;0) MER and Beagle would have complemented each other;
    neither mission can do as much science as both together could have done,
    and that's what's important.

    Frink

    --
    Doctor J. Frink : 'Rampant Ribald Ringtail'
    See his mind here : http://www.cmp.liv.ac.uk/frink/
    Annoy his mind here : pjf at cmp dot liv dot ack dot ook
    "No sir, I didn't like it!" - Mr Horse

  7. #7
    MichaelJP's Avatar
    MichaelJP Guest

    Default Britains Reaction to NASA's success


    "Martin" <mpsXXX137@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    news:btuaip$r8m$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...2F01%2F11%2Fwm
    different, or

    Do you think so? I got the impression that most of the UK media would have
    loved Beagle to be a success, especially as Pillinger has been seen as a
    real "character".

    - Michael



  8. #8
    Doctor J. Frink's Avatar
    Doctor J. Frink Guest

    Default Britains Reaction to NASA's success

    On Mon, 12 Jan 2004 15:09:38 -0000, MichaelJP <MJP@nospam.com> wrote:

    I listened to a debate on Radio 2, which had some pontificating, pompous
    toff saying it had all been a complete waste of time and money[1] and it
    should have gone into genetics "which we're already very strong in"
    apparently, and that we were merely trying to play second fiddle to the
    more expensive NASA rovers (ignoring the fact that the two missions
    could do some quite different things). I wonder if he would have said
    the same if Beagle had been beaming back data by then...

    The idea of trying to be very strong in a new area doesn't seem to be
    useful according to him. Stick at what you're good at! Never try
    anything new! No wonder GB has gone downhill if prats like that have any
    influence.

    There are always a few who like to jump in and make themselves sound
    very important by predicting doom *after* the event. Didn't hear many of
    these people saying it was all a waste of time and money *before* it
    landed...

    Frink

    [1] Despite the fact that even though Beagle has disappeared it has
    generated a lot of equipment, technology and knowledge which can be used
    in future missions and terrestrial science, not to mention generated
    enormous public enthusiasm in science. This makes it a success and a
    good use of resources in my book.

    --
    Doctor J. Frink : 'Rampant Ribald Ringtail'
    See his mind here : http://www.cmp.liv.ac.uk/frink/
    Annoy his mind here : pjf at cmp dot liv dot ack dot ook
    "No sir, I didn't like it!" - Mr Horse

  9. #9
    Ethan Trewhitt's Avatar
    Ethan Trewhitt Guest

    Default Britains Reaction to NASA's success

    According to Elysium Fossa <elysiumfossa@netscape.net>:

    I find it offensive that they call Hubble a "fiasco."

    --
    eth'nT
    http://www.hydrous.net
    aim: courtarro



  10. #10
    Michael Anthony's Avatar
    Michael Anthony Guest

    Default Britains Reaction to NASA's success

    "Martin" <mpsXXX137@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    news:btuaip$r8m$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...

    I remember a similarly negative piece in the BBC prior to the mission to fix
    the Hubble ST. They stated that in the aftermath of the loss of Space
    Shuttle Challenger, NASA's reputation was now "on the line" in the face of
    increasing schepticism about its relevance, and so on, and so on. They
    seemed to be at pains to avoid saying something positive, which leads me to
    believe that they just don't understand the relevance and necessity of space
    exploration and research. Could this be evidence of a more fundamental
    cultural difference? I've heard it suggested that the British are simply
    less inclined to take risks, as a symptom of a more stagnant culture. (And
    this is from a Brit.)

    The Beagle 2 team, on the other hand, posted good-luck messages to NASA on
    their website. The sneering most definitely did not emanate from them.

    It's also possible that NASA is a victim of its own success. In captaining
    so many successful missions in their short history, they make the difficult
    appear mundane. The public got bored of shuttle missions, for example, but
    everyone who truly paid attention knew that the shuttle was still dangerous
    to fly. For a critic to spout a list of NASA's "costly failures" is
    therefore to overlook the fact that when risk is high, failures are part of
    the business.

    With regards to Spirit and Opportunity being labelled repeats, let me ask
    this : if we had only discovered the means to get to Antarctica in 1960, and
    sent three scientific missions over the course of three decades, would it be
    entirely a repeat to send a fourth or could we claim that we had learned
    everything there is to know about the place?

    --
    Michael Anthony



 

 
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